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iamanudist
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 Posted - 10/02/2007 : 12:13:23 PM
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My daughter just turned 16. She wears only minimal clothing without panties. She will not wear any panties or bras. She refuses to wear them and this concerns me. The only clothes she has now are the smallest short shorts, the smallest sleeveless tops that fit, short skirts and short dresses. Her skirts, and summer dresses are about mid thigh in length, with loose pleated bottoms. She says they are long enough and loose enough more like a gown so she doesn’t need panties. She says she is much more comfortable without them. She also said that while she is sitting down one would have to have to look hard to notice her not wearing any. In fact the only time she wears panties is when she has her period.
Therefore, I would like to know if there is anything wrong with my daughter not wearing any underwear? She hardly wears much but she doesn’t even flaunt her appearance because she doesn’t even have any makeup. She is just her natural self and is very happy with minimal. Therefore should I have any objection to her wearing minimal without wearing panties or bras? She might go to the store in just a nylon camisole, and micro shorts or just a short opened back mini dress with sandals. Sometime I think she its because she is very athletic, and she keeps in shape so her body shows well. In fact she will not even wear ankle length socks with her running shoes. I guess living in south Florida in a warm climate has a lot to do with it. She is very confident with her body so should I consider doing anything and if so what should I do? Is it ok that she continues to go minimally dressed without wearing any underwear if this is what she wants? Any advice is greatly appreciated and I appreciate any opinions for what is best.
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Cheri
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Posted - 10/02/2007 : 1:24:08 PM
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Yes, you should require your 16-yr. old daughter to wear underwear along with more clothing when it's appropriate to do so such as school, going to the store/market. What it sounds like she's a bit of an exhibitionist.
A mid-thigh skirt or dress is way too short to go without panties.
Since the breast is not sexualized (or shouldn't be), I see no problem if she doesn't wear one as long as she wears a jacket or shirt with pockets that cover the nipple. Without that covering it is indeed exhibitionistic. I've not worn a bra for over 5 yrs. but make sure I'm wearing something that makes it not noticeable.
Cheri
Doing what I can to positively promote nudism
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Digital_Cowboy
Forum Member
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Posted - 10/02/2007 : 9:59:46 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by iamanudist
My daughter just turned 16. She wears only minimal clothing without panties. She will not wear any panties or bras. She refuses to wear them and this concerns me. The only clothes she has now are the smallest short shorts, the smallest sleeveless tops that fit, short skirts and short dresses. Her skirts, and summer dresses are about mid thigh in length, with loose pleated bottoms. She says they are long enough and loose enough more like a gown so she doesn’t need panties. She says she is much more comfortable without them. She also said that while she is sitting down one would have to have to look hard to notice her not wearing any. In fact the only time she wears panties is when she has her period.
Therefore, I would like to know if there is anything wrong with my daughter not wearing any underwear? She hardly wears much but she doesn’t even flaunt her appearance because she doesn’t even have any makeup. She is just her natural self and is very happy with minimal. Therefore should I have any objection to her wearing minimal without wearing panties or bras? She might go to the store in just a nylon camisole, and micro shorts or just a short opened back mini dress with sandals. Sometime I think she its because she is very athletic, and she keeps in shape so her body shows well. In fact she will not even wear ankle length socks with her running shoes. I guess living in south Florida in a warm climate has a lot to do with it. She is very confident with her body so should I consider doing anything and if so what should I do? Is it ok that she continues to go minimally dressed without wearing any underwear if this is what she wants? Any advice is greatly appreciated and I appreciate any opinions for what is best.
iamanudist,
Unlike Ms Cheri I am NOT going to make the assumption that your daughter has "negative" or "ulterior" motives for how and why she dresses the way that she does. Instead I am going to choose to presume that like a LOT of us she doesn’t like the feel of tight, restrictive or binding clothes. As well as being as comfortable as is possible.
And I would have to say that as long as there are no complaints from any of the following:
A) her school
B) the stores that she goes to
C) local law enforcement
Then what she chooses to wear or not wear is of no concern for anyone but yourself, your spouse and your daughter.
In the clothes that she wears, is the material thick and opaque enough that anyone from a resonable distance cannot see through ’em and be able to tell that she is walking around sans bra & panties? If so again there should be no problems with what she chooses to wear or not wear.
When your daughter is out and about does she engage in behavior that would reveal herself to others or does she carry herself as a mature young adult? If she is carrying herself in such a manner that to the casual obsevere that she is sans bra/panties or is otherwise flashing or exposing herself to other’s then yes you need to say something to her. But if as I said she behaves as a mature young adult who has made the choice not to wear under garments then what’s the problem?
Herman
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jeanluc
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Posted - 10/02/2007 : 10:13:34 PM
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Unfortunately this is not just about comfort or lack of it. A 16 yr old girl is around 16 yr old boys and it doesn't matter how mature she acts or whether she wears solid material and sits so she doesn't show herself. 16 yr old boys "KNOW" that she is not wearing a bra. If they see her once without panties, they will "KNOW" she doesn't wear them. There is no way a girl in high school can get through life without accidentally revealing that she has nothing on under a flimsy or short dress.
This is more an issue of safety for her than comfort. There are too many nut cases - even in the 16 yr old crowd - that for her to be flaunting herself - albiet innocently - in front of them for someone to not assume she is 'loose' and will take advantage of that.
She should wear panties in public, period. A harrassed or worse situation would be a lot less comfortable for a very long time than not wearing panties for short time each day.
Live - Laugh - Love
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Nudony
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Posted - 10/02/2007 : 10:41:56 PM
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Certainly, many people will be divided on this issue. I will bring up the example of a co-worker, even though she was in her early twenties. A home nudist and very comfortable with her body, she would wear as little clothing as possible, ranging from tank top and miniskirt to very short, loose fitting dress. And almost always sans underwear. Although I understood where she was coming from in wanting to feel as nude as possible, this also caused other people to perceive her as "sleazy." She was also sent home in the beginning of her employment because she was perceptibly not wearing a bra.
This gets even trickier in a public school environment. As Jean Luc put it, teens (especially boys) are not even more prone to jumping to conclusions, and act on it, than adults. And you don't want your daughter to find herself in a situation she can't get out of without some emotional, or physical damage. Although Digital Cowboy makes a good point, he is not taking into account the level of maturity of high school kids.
My recommendation: review her wardrobe (with her), and determine what presents a risk, and what doesn't. A knee long skirt sans underwear is probably fine; a shirt and buttoned vest also. Tank tops and miniskirts should be very carefuly reviewed.
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Digital_Cowboy
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Posted - 10/03/2007 : 12:51:50 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by jeanluc
Unfortunately this is not just about comfort or lack of it. A 16 yr old girl is around 16 yr old boys and it doesn’t matter how mature she acts or whether she wears solid material and sits so she doesn’t show herself. 16 yr old boys "KNOW" that she is not wearing a bra. If they see her once without panties, they will "KNOW" she doesn’t wear them. There is no way a girl in high school can get through life without accidentally revealing that she has nothing on under a flimsy or short dress.
This is more an issue of safety for her than comfort. There are too many nut cases - even in the 16 yr old crowd - that for her to be flaunting herself - albeit innocently - in front of them for someone to not assume she is ’loose’ and will take advantage of that.
She should wear panties in public, period. A harassed or worse situation would be a lot less comfortable for a very long time than not wearing panties for short time each day.
Live - Laugh - Love
jeanluc,
While admittedly you do make some very good points however again we cannot and should not allow the thoughts or possible actions of another to dictate what we do or how we dress or not dress. As the aforementioned young lady could be wearing a floor length flannel/turtleneck dress complete with opera gloves, and burka(sp) thingeys with only her eyes showing and those same immature 16-year old boys can still harass her or worse.
As we all know that nuns get raped and/or murdered while they’re wearing their habits and those responsible still try and use the "she was asking for it" defense. It doesn’t matter one iota what someone is wearing IF someone else wants to harass or to do worse to them they’ll come up with any excuse to "justify" their actions.
Sadly there are too many "nutcases" in all aspects of our lives. Trust me as I’ve said in another and related thread that it is something that I have to deal with on an almost daily basis being a cyclist.
As I have lost count of the number of times that I’ve had the following happen:
A) been tailgated by motorists
B) have had motorists shut obscenities at me
C) throw things at me
And
D) force me off of the road
Yet, I can’t, won’t and will NEVER allow the actions of said drivers to stop me from doing something that I enjoy very much. To do so would be to allow them to "win" as it were, and that is something I will not allow to happen.
Again we cannot control what someone else thinks or "know." Nor should we allow their "thoughts" or "knowledge" or possible actions to dictate what we do or wear.
To do so gives them too much power over us and our lives, and NO one should ever have that much control over another person. As there will always be people out there who think this or that or that they just "know" this or that about a person just by looking at them.
Herman
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Nudony
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Posted - 10/03/2007 : 5:33:23 PM
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Again, very valid point. BUT it's not the adult world we're talking about here; it's high school and the world of teenagers.
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SunTanMan
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Posted - 10/03/2007 : 6:30:11 PM
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Iamanudist,
I am a fellow Floridian and I very much appreciate what you are saying about the temperature.
My wife grew up in the Bible belt but after all these years of living in Florida,and a bad bout of hot flashes,the only thing she hates worst than panties are bras.
I can only assume by your name that your daughter was raised as, and is a nudist. If so, I am sure it is even more difficult for her to wear underclothes.
As far as nipples go, who cares. I work very close to a jr. high school and often times I am traveling along the same route that the kids take as they walk home from school. I am sure that in some parts of the country some people would be shocked at what these young gals are wearing but for where we live it is almost like a school uniform.
Cheri, I know where you live and I certainly can understand where you are coming from. For you to show up for work with your nipples showing would be the talk of the building but, if you worked where I lived it would just be 'another nipple'.
I believe it is generally know that the closer people live to the equator, the less clothes they wear which is very understandable.
Anyway, I am sure you are a loving and caring parent and have talked to your daughter about sex, drugs and alcohol, which are far more important issues than panties and nipples.
STM
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BareBoomer
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Posted - 10/03/2007 : 6:50:56 PM
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There has been a fair amount of conversation about this topic regarding your daughter. I too have lived in south Florida and know that there is a much more frank attitude to the body than in other parts of the U.S. I also imagine from your username that you are a nudist and very possibly allow or encourage it within your family. This if fine and it probably means that your daughter is quite comfortable being nude around the house or skinny-dipping in the pool. No problems there. This would also explain why she can be comfortable being as naked as possible under her outer clothes. In certain situations, this may be fine, but I would rather know that she was over 18 and not 16.
I now live in southern California and am a high school teacher. It is fair to say that many of the young women on our campus wear very little and are not particularly careful about how they conduct themselves. I can tell you from being in front of a class 5 hours a day that girls who wear short skirts are not always careful and reveal more than they may think. In this instance, I believe it is always appropriate to wear underwear. Under shorts or pants, this may not be as important and I know that numbers of girls on our campus don't bother with underwear. It has to be more comfortable than a thong!
My point would be this. There are situations where it is appropriate to wear a tuxedo or formal gown for homecoming or prom. There are situations where a T-shirt and jeans are appropriate. There are also situations where "nothing seems appropriate" and those of us who enjoy being nude surely understand that. The trick is understanding how to dress appropriately for the situation. School is NOT an appropriate setting for displaying as much as possible. While nudists may understand a measure of separation between nudity and sexuality, not all members of society do. The guys on my campus would have great difficulty with the distinction!
Please, encourage your daughter to wear something underneath if she is wearing a dress or short skirt. It is, in some sense, a courtesy to the males on campus, including teachers. While I am old enough to be a grandfather to my students, there are still things that I don't want to know or see in the context of school. As I see it, this is about making appropriate choices about dress, depending on the context.
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Digital_Cowboy
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Posted - 10/04/2007 : 04:11:33 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Nudony
Again, very valid point. BUT it’s not the adult world we’re talking about here; it’s high school and the world of teenagers.
Nudony,
I understand what you’re saying, but as I said and I’m sure you both understand and realize. Is that it doesn’t matter what she wears IF any of the other kids want to harass her or worse, sadly they will.
I’m sure that when I was in junior high/high school that there were plenty of young ladies who didn’t always wear either a bra or panties or both. And NONE of ’em were ever harassed or worse.
Likewise I am sure that most parents have done a good enough job of teaching their children right from wrong as well as being tolerant of others that to the majority it isn’t going to matter one-way or the other what someone chooses to wear or not to wear.
And again as long the parents haven’t received any complaints for the school and she hasn’t come home complaining about being harassed then why look for problems where they don’t exist? Especially considering the more real problems of teen drug and alcohol abuse, as well as teen gangs.
So please lets concentrate on the real problems out there, and not worry about what some 16 or 17-yr old is or isn’t wearing under her clothes. Especially if as I’ve said the parents haven’t received any complaints from the school or she hasn’t been harassed while at school.
Herman
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Balto Bob
$ Supporter
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Posted - 10/04/2007 : 11:15:22 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by iamanudist
My daughter just turned 16. She wears only minimal clothing without panties. She will not wear any panties or bras. She refuses to wear them and this concerns me.... In fact the only time she wears panties is when she has her period.
She might go to the store in just a nylon camisole, and micro shorts or just a short opened back mini dress with sandals.
Someone recently posted that the school had complained about their daughters not wearing underwear. You don't seem to have that problem. The fact is at 16 your daughter is going to pretty independant. As others have posted if this is the biggest problem you have, you have done a good job so far. I quoted some of your first post. Pick your battles. What she wears to the store is not real important. Teenagers can spend a lot of money on clothes, etc. Sounds like your way ahead.
Bob
Have a nice NUDE day !!
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beachnudist
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Posted - 10/04/2007 : 1:35:28 PM
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I think Balto Bob has rumbled this one when he found this posters other thread "Clothes with less coverage for a positive image" concerning making rules for an 18 year old girl so that she wears little or nothing in public.
This poster has also started 2 threads about public nudity in Spain. Martha as the posts are signed never seems to make any follow up comment . It seems iamanudist likes to get us talking about exhibitionist behavior for some strange reason known only to "herself". Maybe I am wrong and if I am, I apologize, but I wait to hear from Martha.
I see Martha has just this instant removed the post "Clothes with less coverage for a positive image"
Actually iamanudist spent about twenty minutes reading all the replies here and left without comment. I think it is up to the Admin or the moderator to follow up on this troll.
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Edited by - beachnudist on 10/04/2007 2:07:25 PM |
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Bare Warrior
Forum Member
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Posted - 10/04/2007 : 6:00:34 PM
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I am sorry folks but we live in a real world and a real society. Sure it would be nice to do exactly as we want to do everywhere but you can't do that in any society and living outside society's rules is chaos.
To allow your daughter into a teenage school setting without panties, around hormone driven boys and girls, herself included, is simple irresponsible, if down right dangerous. High schools are sexually charged enough but allow this behavior and you are subjecting her to a possible social stigma that will follow her all her life, get her preyed upon by every sexist boy in the school and possibly raped. If she is sexually assaulted and the jury learns that she was not wearing underwear, it is doubtful they will return a guilty plea and most people are likely to villianize her, not the boy. If she is simply caught without underwear on, she will most likely be suspended or expelled and if she is caught multiple times it is highly likely that she will be required to see a psychiatrist.
It is wrong and unfair that these things might happen to her but life isn't fair. Is it really worth the possible consequences?
Sorry to be so strong in my statement, but we are talking real serious consequences here.
Bare Warrior
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illusion
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Posted - 10/04/2007 : 8:31:49 PM
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I have read each entry to this thread. There have been many different and well thought out points. However I have one question. Forgetting for the moment that we have someones daughter involved. Is it not this kind of thing which usually leads to someone saying shouldn't we pass a law against this type of behavior? Further lets make an example of this person?
While I believe this should be left up to the parent. And I agree that if this is the worst thing she has done you have done a good job. I do not think that the general public would agree with this. (Does not matter that others may have done it first.) Should one of the other parents of a student in the school decide that they should make an issue of this. Then what will the consequences be? And not just for her. Could not one possible consequence of her action end up being a uniform for the whole school. Another entry above said as a teacher in the school system this happens more often that it seems.
Yes it would be nice if she could do this without fear of something happening, or our fear of something happening. And it may be just that our fear. However does society reconize our fear. No not really. Society sets laws and standards of conduct which they determine or believe to be in the best intrest of all parties. (Or so our elected officals think.) I know this has been going on for a long long time. Girls were doing this back when I was in school. (I won't say how long ago.) But in this case I am afraid I have to agree with Cheri.
It is not so much that we should alter our own actions. But our responsibility is to promote a positive image. If this becomes an issue at the school. Would you think this would promote a positive image?
Here is an example. Most motor cyclist are responsible law abiding people. Yet recently I have heard a report that in the Washington DC area they are having a problem on the beltway with motor cyclist riding at excessive speeds and weaving in and out of the other traffic. Those few are promoting a bad image. Does not matter that they are few. The image is still there and other motorist are starting to complain about all motor cyclist.
Is that fair. NO of course not. Will it lead to further problems. Yes it already has. Though banning motor cycles has not happened YET. Still at 16 she is probably very independent. Not sure how much you can persuade her to be more socially responsible.
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Nudony
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Posted - 10/04/2007 : 8:57:03 PM
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Just one last point...
A couple of posters have mentionned that this is taking place in Florida, and that people tend to wear less clothes in sunny Florida anyway. I grew up in France, when and where toplessness was prevalent. Most of the girls at my school went topless at the community pool, and almost the entire school hung out there in the summer; consequently, if some of the girls were noticeably not wearing a bra at school (which was frequent in the summer), it didn't cause much of a stir since it was part of the culture.
Florida may be hot and summerwear may be thinner there than in most places; but Florida is not France. Lack of underwear is still not part of the culture there. So there does exist a risk for the daughter to be singled out and vilified for her lack of clothing.
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DKS
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Posted - 10/05/2007 : 12:36:46 AM
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Hello All,
Six one way... one half a dozen the other. I would like to add a few comments to the mother of this girl. First and far most....you are the mother and ultimately responsible until she becomes an adult. 13 to 19 is a challenging time for all teens. This is where the began to experiment with smoking, drinking, sex and drugs to name a few. This is also an age where they began to realize their sexuality and orientation. Not in anyway saying that your kid is involved in any of this ...this is part of the world around then. You speak with confidence in regards to her maturity and decision making process but the fact remains.....you asked a question (Why did you ask it?) There is something you are not comfortable with and now you just need to follow your instincts. Do a google search (family watch dog) using your area code and see how many preditors are out there. Barely in the safe zones in regards to distances from schools and bus stops. If they were harmless... why does law enforcement watch and keep tabs on them?
Dewey
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Should I require my daughter to wear underwear
